Sir Cliff's says 'Gone are the days when we assumed loving relationships would be solely between men and women'

 

I can not begin to express the sadness I feel regarding Cliff Richards comments regarding Gay Marriage being blessed by the church.

I have long admired Sir Cliff for the courageous stand he has taken over his Christianity right from his conversion. Whilst I could not call myself a fan of his music, I have always thought that he held his faith in Jesus in the highest regard, and put aside the pressures placed on him by the media to get married or in deed over his sexuality.

It has come as a great surprise to me therefore to read articles in the Times and the Independent who both say that Sir Cliff has asked the church to accept and bless same sex relationships. 

Read Article

This paragraph seems to sum up the essence of what was said.

He calls on the Church of England to update its views on same-sex marriages, arguing that all judgements on sexuality should be left to God. “I think the Church must come round and see people as they are now. Gone are the days when we assumed loving relationships would be solely between men and women. It seems to me that commitment is the issue, and if anyone comes to me and says: ‘This is my partner; we are committed to each other’, then I don’t care what their sexuality is. I’m not going to judge; I’ll leave that to God.”

 

Read Article

I can not be completely sure that we are all talking about the same thing. No one is contending that “loving relationships” can occur between people of the same sex. I have a  loving relationship with my father, and my sons. I have loving relationships with male friends. The difference however is that this “love” does not find its expression in sex or anything remotely sexual. So surly the issue here is not the issue of “Loving Relationships”, but one of “Sexual Relationships”. That being the case I would like to address the key elements of the above comment.

 

Church to Update its View

View must be based on the Bible, not culture or political correctness

 

Gone are the days when we (church) assumed loving relationships would be solely between men and women

I am not sure that this has ever been true. From its conception the church has been VERY aware of same sex relationships. In fact the old testament shows us that the fore-runner to the church, the people of Israel (the Jewish nation) were very aware of sexual relationships between people of the same sex. The New Testament to speaks on this issue also. It is difficult to understand how the church is being asked to “update” its position because the times have changed. In fact the times of the New Testament Rome Homosexuality was rife, probably more so than now. So the churches position on this is based on similar cultural issues as today with regard to same sex relationships.  

 

It seems to me

While Sir Cliff is entitled to his opinion we must not loose site that we are created in the image of God and not the other way around. That means that we can not put our opinions on God. We need to understand Gods views, plans and laws based on the bible I believe he has provided us. Nowhere in the bible, which I believe Cliff holds dear, does it say that “commitment is all that matters”. It says that the only context for sex is within a heterosexual marriage between one man and one woman. Yes that relationship is within deep commitment, a covenant in fact, but only within the context of a heterosexual marriage.

 

I don’t care what their sexuality, I’m not going to Judge

Now on this point I totally agree. It is not our place to Judge someone. As Cliff says “Ill leave that to God”. That said the bible does give us the ability to evaluate right and wrong. Not a postmodern right and wrong, an individual right and wrong, but an absolute right and wrong. The bible is clear from beginning to end that sex is only permissible within a heterosexual marriage between one man and one woman. We can see that the actions of any individual in the sight of God that goes away from this is wrong. As Christians, or anyone else, I don’t believe we have the right to water down what the bible says as true. What we must guard against however is ostracising those that choose to live outside of the things that God says is best for us or that offend him. I believe that we should be friends with them, discuss things with them and pray that they see God for themselves. This is the only way that we can expect them to understand that what they are doing is contrary to what God wishes for them. Lets not get all out of shape over the “gay” issue. We can apply the same position to anything that we do, or don’t do, that offends God. I have done things that offend God, and before I became a christian I was quite happy doing them too. I have friends that are Gay, I have friends that are not Christians that live a life that I know offends God. I don’t judge them, I hope and pray that as I talk with them, they see that I am no better than them but my life has changed. Not because of what I have done in being “good” or anything like that but because of what God has done for me. Although I offend God and am unable to live according to the commands of the bible God himself has made away for that to change. Ihave been forgiven of all those things (and the things that I still do from time to time) and because of the message of Love that Jesus death on the cross demonstrates I have come to an understanding of God and a friendship with him. My hope and prayer is that others too can investigate the claims of Jesus and come to really understand the message of the bible.

 

Conclusion

All that said it must be plain to see that “the Church” can not possibly endorse something that is fundamentally in opposition to the very bible texts that it is based on. It would be like the vegetarian society being told that “gone are the days when we assumed that all vegetarians would not eat meat”. You would call me crazy if I told you I was a vegetarian who ate meet. So it would, in my opinion, be just as crazy for the church to endourse same sex marriage.

Come on Cliff !

Sir Cliff’s says ‘Gone are the days when we assumed loving relationships would be solely between men and women’

 

I can not begin to express the sadness I feel regarding Cliff Richards comments regarding Gay Marriage being blessed by the church.

I have long admired Sir Cliff for the courageous stand he has taken over his Christianity right from his conversion. Whilst I could not call myself a fan of his music, I have always thought that he held his faith in Jesus in the highest regard, and put aside the pressures placed on him by the media to get married or in deed over his sexuality.

It has come as a great surprise to me therefore to read articles in the Times and the Independent who both say that Sir Cliff has asked the church to accept and bless same sex relationships. 

Read Article

This paragraph seems to sum up the essence of what was said.

He calls on the Church of England to update its views on same-sex marriages, arguing that all judgements on sexuality should be left to God. “I think the Church must come round and see people as they are now. Gone are the days when we assumed loving relationships would be solely between men and women. It seems to me that commitment is the issue, and if anyone comes to me and says: ‘This is my partner; we are committed to each other’, then I don’t care what their sexuality is. I’m not going to judge; I’ll leave that to God.”

 

Read Article

I can not be completely sure that we are all talking about the same thing. No one is contending that “loving relationships” can occur between people of the same sex. I have a  loving relationship with my father, and my sons. I have loving relationships with male friends. The difference however is that this “love” does not find its expression in sex or anything remotely sexual. So surly the issue here is not the issue of “Loving Relationships”, but one of “Sexual Relationships”. That being the case I would like to address the key elements of the above comment.

 

Church to Update its View

View must be based on the Bible, not culture or political correctness

 

Gone are the days when we (church) assumed loving relationships would be solely between men and women

I am not sure that this has ever been true. From its conception the church has been VERY aware of same sex relationships. In fact the old testament shows us that the fore-runner to the church, the people of Israel (the Jewish nation) were very aware of sexual relationships between people of the same sex. The New Testament to speaks on this issue also. It is difficult to understand how the church is being asked to “update” its position because the times have changed. In fact the times of the New Testament Rome Homosexuality was rife, probably more so than now. So the churches position on this is based on similar cultural issues as today with regard to same sex relationships.  

 

It seems to me

While Sir Cliff is entitled to his opinion we must not loose site that we are created in the image of God and not the other way around. That means that we can not put our opinions on God. We need to understand Gods views, plans and laws based on the bible I believe he has provided us. Nowhere in the bible, which I believe Cliff holds dear, does it say that “commitment is all that matters”. It says that the only context for sex is within a heterosexual marriage between one man and one woman. Yes that relationship is within deep commitment, a covenant in fact, but only within the context of a heterosexual marriage.

 

I don’t care what their sexuality, I’m not going to Judge

Now on this point I totally agree. It is not our place to Judge someone. As Cliff says “Ill leave that to God”. That said the bible does give us the ability to evaluate right and wrong. Not a postmodern right and wrong, an individual right and wrong, but an absolute right and wrong. The bible is clear from beginning to end that sex is only permissible within a heterosexual marriage between one man and one woman. We can see that the actions of any individual in the sight of God that goes away from this is wrong. As Christians, or anyone else, I don’t believe we have the right to water down what the bible says as true. What we must guard against however is ostracising those that choose to live outside of the things that God says is best for us or that offend him. I believe that we should be friends with them, discuss things with them and pray that they see God for themselves. This is the only way that we can expect them to understand that what they are doing is contrary to what God wishes for them. Lets not get all out of shape over the “gay” issue. We can apply the same position to anything that we do, or don’t do, that offends God. I have done things that offend God, and before I became a christian I was quite happy doing them too. I have friends that are Gay, I have friends that are not Christians that live a life that I know offends God. I don’t judge them, I hope and pray that as I talk with them, they see that I am no better than them but my life has changed. Not because of what I have done in being “good” or anything like that but because of what God has done for me. Although I offend God and am unable to live according to the commands of the bible God himself has made away for that to change. Ihave been forgiven of all those things (and the things that I still do from time to time) and because of the message of Love that Jesus death on the cross demonstrates I have come to an understanding of God and a friendship with him. My hope and prayer is that others too can investigate the claims of Jesus and come to really understand the message of the bible.

 

Conclusion

All that said it must be plain to see that “the Church” can not possibly endorse something that is fundamentally in opposition to the very bible texts that it is based on. It would be like the vegetarian society being told that “gone are the days when we assumed that all vegetarians would not eat meat”. You would call me crazy if I told you I was a vegetarian who ate meet. So it would, in my opinion, be just as crazy for the church to endourse same sex marriage.

Come on Cliff !